SBS 2003

Re: Client accessing website problems

David Overton — Wed, 28 Feb 2007 21:09:55 GMT

Richard,

I absolutely understand the frustration and hopefully you understand my defense of SBS. I have received your offline details and will contact you seperately. Hopefully we will get to a point where you can recommend SBS to people :-)

thanks

David

Re: Client accessing website problems

Spectra — Wed, 28 Feb 2007 16:09:23 GMT

Hi David

first off, a bit of humble pie. I was unfair with some of what I said, but was frustrated to say the least.

The local tech support bloke couldn't find anything wrong, we have changed to using a single network card on the SBS server and it all works.

I will drop you a line, as I would love to know what it is form my own sanity!

Thanks

Richard

Re: Client accessing website problems

David Overton — Wed, 28 Feb 2007 08:26:24 GMT

It might also be worth using Fiddler - http://www.windowsmarketplace.com/details.aspx?view=info&itemid=2695979# - to compare the output from a PC directly connected to the router to one going via SBS. They should be identical, but if not then that might point to an issue.

As I said, I am 99.99% certain this is not SBS at fault and I am willing to place a bet with my skills to prove it. If you e-mail me (mail in previous post) I will send you my contact details here at Microsoft.

ttfn

David

Re: Client accessing website problems

David Overton — Tue, 27 Feb 2007 20:42:30 GMT

And I am assuming that you know that you have a remote admin web interface (and terminal services) with SBS?

thanks

David

Re: Client accessing website problems

David Overton — Tue, 27 Feb 2007 20:28:34 GMT

Richard,

I am a man who has faith in my products (I do work for Microsoft obviously) and I am 99.99% certain this is not a SBS issue. I think the reason you have not found anything like this out there is for that reason. I have diagnosed hundreds of problems like this and they have come down to either bad network config or 3rd party applications.

I have an offer - create me an admin account, give me a sample web address that does not work and mail me details of the ip/address, username and password (doverton@microsoft.com) and I will have a look tonight. MS only charges for tickets when it is not a bug. That leaves 3rd party apps or configurations that are at fault when we charge for the ticket. As I said - I don't think it is SBS, but I am happy to be proven wrong.

As for the support - I used to sell and support Unix and Linux systems and they also have their problems and willing assistants, but there comes a point where you still have to pay for support.

Right, I'm leaving the office as I should have been home hours ago - the offer stands. I also think it is a little quick to say SBS can't be recommended because you are seeing these issues - are you telling me that when setting up non-MS systems you don't ever get setup or config issues? In the UK alone we have thousands of partners who install and configure SBS on a daily basis and these systems form part of a fantastic solution these partners offer customers. SBS is cost effective and offers great services, such as those provided by Exchange and SharePoint. The health check tools and wizards mean that most problems like this are resolved by simply re-running the tools.

If the issue is really a blocking of jScript then SBS is not doing that (assuming that your users are running XP or Vista and not server on their desktops) Obviously since server has the extra protection tools loaded (any version of Windows Server 2003) then you get a more restricted web experience using servers.

ttfn

David

Re: Client accessing website problems

Spectra — Tue, 27 Feb 2007 19:58:31 GMT

Hi David

We have the bitdefender AV software suite, which includes firewall etc, but this didn't work before we installed bitdefender (but I though I should install it as the email was working and I didn't want a virus on top of all this!)

To be honest, I have given up and we have a support company coming in to see us in the morning, I did phone Dell, but they basically said it wasn't a hardware problem, so they wouldn't support it without us purchasing NOS tickets at £500 for 3 tickets..........

As I said before, you have been more than helpfull and I am very greatful to you, but, I would certainly think twice before buying another Microsoft server or similar product. We bought SBS instead of going for Linux as I thought we would have the support of Microsoft (like Microsoft state in the sales pitch!), rather than relying on the kindness of others, but as it turns out I was wrong, and having spent many hours hunting round, it seems there is more support for Linux on the net.

As part of my 'normal' day job, I write embedded C solutions for many microcontrollers including the PIC (plus 8051, ARM etc), the PIC C compiler for this was £100, for this you get unlimited email support and free upgrades for a year! I think this puts Microsoft to shame.

Spectra belong to several small business groups, and I have sorted network solutions for many of our group of 'friends' from these, I will not be recommending any of them to use SBS after this experience.

Thanks for your help anyway.

Richard

Re: Client accessing website problems

David Overton — Tue, 27 Feb 2007 12:27:00 GMT

I have never heard of SBS causing this type of problem - what AV and firewall solutions do you have in place?

On the SBS side - any PC that is part of a domain has to get certain info from the DNS inside the domain - this has info such as where to find the domain controller etc. DNS on Windows server delivers this functionality.

thanks

David

Re: Client accessing website problems

Spectra — Tue, 27 Feb 2007 11:55:10 GMT

The client PCs work fine when not connected to SBS, so it must be SBS

Why does it show itself as the DNS server on the internet NIC tho?

Do you have any suggestions for an SBS partner (as I don't fancy paying MS £199 for a phone call which is what it says on the website!)

I must say that you have been great! but I can honestly say that I am disappointed with the lack of support by Dell and MS (bearing in mind we have had the machine for less than a week, neither want to know without putting your hand in your pocket)

Thanks

Richard

Re: Client accessing website problems

David Overton — Tue, 27 Feb 2007 11:30:17 GMT

OK, the reply has come through - if the problem is Javascript based then it looks like some of the security policies for IE are causing problems. IF you are using IE on the server then the security features could well lead to this. If you try it on XP, it should not have this problem.

To check to see if the problem is native to XP:

plug a PC directly into the router and access your web sites - if the porblem disappears then it is the network layer in SBS somewhere

if the problem continues to happen then it is either the router or the XP configurations. I am used to some anti-virus products giving you the problems you describe.

If it looks like XP - You could try:

- changing the security settings in the security tab in IE for the site to lower the security and check that javascript is enabled

- putting a PC with a clean build of XP on it, not joined to the domain and accessing the web site - if this works then something in your AV / Domain settings is likely to be causing the problems. Add the AV software one at a time and then join the domain - at each stage test the connection - if it fails at a particular point you know where the issue is.

It may well be worth finding a SBSC partner or calling the MS support line or to help diagnose the issue.

ttfn

David

Re: Client accessing website problems

Spectra — Tue, 27 Feb 2007 10:49:55 GMT

Hi David

Did you get my reply to below? only it hasn't appeared on the forum?

Thanks

Richard

David Overton:

I do think it is likely to be a DNS issue, but can never be sure, so would confirm the following:

SBS server has 1 NIC plugged into router and 2nd NIC plugges into private internal LAN. All users plug into private LAN only.

check that if I do an IPConfig on the clients then the DNS IP address is that of the server (do the clients take a while to log in?)

check the dns from the admin tools (right click on the server and look at the diagnostics

Look in the event log to see if there are any network errors

do things like tracert www.orange.co,uk (or the right url) to check that it goes through to the site

plug a windows XP machine into the internet router and see if that has the same problems

Feel free to post the results of the netsh diag gui or IPConfig /all from the server and a client.

ttfn

David

Re: Client accessing website problems

Spectra — Tue, 27 Feb 2007 10:47:19 GMT

Hi David

Could this be something to do with javascript? only I have been trying to access various websites and it seems that anything which has a javascript enabled submit button doesn't work. I have a login on a secure page using php which works ok.

Thanks

Richard

Re: Client accessing website problems

Spectra — Tue, 27 Feb 2007 10:03:42 GMT

Hi David

1) this is exactly what we have

Windows IP Configuration

        Host Name . . . . . . . . . . . . : Richards_Laptop
        Primary Dns Suffix . . . . . . . :
        Node Type . . . . . . . . . . . . : Hybrid
        IP Routing Enabled. . . . . . . . : No
        WINS Proxy Enabled. . . . . . . . : No
        DNS Suffix Search List. . . . . . : spectradisplays.l

Ethernet adapter Local Area Connection:

        Connection-specific DNS Suffix . : spectradisplays.l
        Description . . . . . . . . . . . : Broadcom 440x 10/
roller
        Physical Address. . . . . . . . . : 00-15-C5-3D-F1-A7
        Dhcp Enabled. . . . . . . . . . . : Yes
        Autoconfiguration Enabled . . . . : Yes
        IP Address. . . . . . . . . . . . : 192.168.0.18
        Subnet Mask . . . . . . . . . . . : 255.255.255.0
        Default Gateway . . . . . . . . . : 192.168.0.25
        DHCP Server . . . . . . . . . . . : 192.168.0.25
        DNS Servers . . . . . . . . . . . : 192.168.0.25
        Primary WINS Server . . . . . . . : 192.168.0.25
        Lease Obtained. . . . . . . . . . : 27 February 2007
        Lease Expires . . . . . . . . . . : 07 March 2007 09:

Ethernet adapter Wireless Network Connection:

        Media State . . . . . . . . . . . : Media disconnecte
        Description . . . . . . . . . . . : Intel(R) PRO/Wire
k Connection
        Physical Address. . . . . . . . . : 00-13-02-DC-71-86

3) DNS admin tool, simple and recursive both pass

4) no network errors that I can see in the log

5) tracert to www.orange.co.uk times out after about number 8

6) no - works ok (which is how I am able to do this post)

netsh passes everything on my machine, but we do get some failures on the server -

the NIC default gateway fails

the default ip gateway fails

the dhcp server fails

the server ip address on the router nic is 192.168.0.4

if I run ipconfig on the server its ip adress etc are correct (all point to the router 192.168.0.1), however it does have itself as the dns server (192.168.0.25 - this is our private network server address) - is this correct?

thanks

Richard

Re: Client accessing website problems

David Overton — Tue, 27 Feb 2007 09:09:45 GMT

I do think it is likely to be a DNS issue, but can never be sure, so would confirm the following:

SBS server has 1 NIC plugged into router and 2nd NIC plugges into private internal LAN. All users plug into private LAN only.
check that if I do an IPConfig on the clients then the DNS IP address is that of the server (do the clients take a while to log in?)
check the dns from the admin tools (right click on the server and look at the diagnostics
Look in the event log to see if there are any network errors
do things like tracert www.orange.co,uk (or the right url) to check that it goes through to the site
plug a windows XP machine into the internet router and see if that has the same problems
Feel free to post the results of the netsh diag gui or IPConfig /all from the server and a client.

ttfn

David

Re: Client accessing website problems

Spectra — Tue, 27 Feb 2007 08:10:32 GMT

Hi David

A little more info (and I will try your suggestions when I get into work)

The machine is a Dell, it came with SBS pre-installed. I used the wizards from the to do list (I also have the SBS companion book by Charlie Russel which I followed), after having done that I have done little else but copy files across.

We are browsing from an XP Pro client machine (although in frustration I have tried browsing the same site from the SBS machine - I know this is bad, so slapped wrists and I won't try it again)

We have bitdefender AV, although we did try this before we installed bitdefender (we had Norton on client machines and our ISP scans email as well) and it didn't work then either, so I don't think it is the AV.

Our isp is F9 and we use there DNS servers in the setup (as from your comments/questions it sounds like it could be a DNS problem)

Thanks for your help (and speedy response!)

Richard

Re: Client accessing website problems

David Overton — Mon, 26 Feb 2007 21:04:16 GMT

OK, I have to ask some basic questions.

Did you configure SBS using the wizards? If so, have you done any config after that? What happens when you try a test in the DNS admin tool (try both tests - local and recursive if I remember).

If that works, from an XP machine try typing the following:

"netsh diag gui" - (without the quotes) does it return any errors. Just to be sure - your not browsing from the SBS box are you?

Finally, what a/v & firewall software is involved?

ttfn

David